Transcription

 Okay. Hi. Hello. I'm Ariel. And I'm Jackie. And we are. I don't know, we are new to this. Let's get our notes. Yeah. I struggle with it like crazy. I'm so glad we made this podcast behind the Lens the Newborn Photographer Diaries because we are both newborn photographers. Hence Jackie's amazing photos behind us. We're in her studio in Grand Rapids, Michigan. Whoo! Yeah! Yeah! Ariel came down today, and, uh, we just will. Not just. We've had a little bit of a kind of fun day, but we, uh, saw a newborn together. Um, shall we say that shot a newborn? Yeah. I mean, we photograph a lot of newborns today. We captured and we captured any more. I mean, you know, that's something we need to talk about because capture just sounds so cheesy. Yeah. I mean, I just want to say shot, but I like I get it. Um. Anyways. Sweet little baby boy. He was. I don't know, he was. He was perfect. It's really spicy babies. Really? Um. I had to like to 20, 25. It's been the year of, like, the not content baby. Yeah. Especially girls. Yeah, I mean sassy. Yeah. So he was amazing. We got a lot. A lot of images. Um, we basically did, like, a full session. Mhm. Um, so the parent images and baby it was just he's cute and he slept so good. Oh yeah. Like I couldn't believe it. Yeah I felt like normally I feel like when you're moving a baby around like you, you have to be so conscious of, like, every movement, every sound. And with him, he just, like, slept through whatever. And we could just, like, talk most of the time and be like, um, like there's a time bomb and. Yeah, but, um, defuse the bomb movement. Yeah. They're always defusing a bomb. Yeah. For sure. Anyway, uh, so we wanted to start this podcast as a way to just, like, kind of connect with other newborn photographers, connect with other people like us, and also because we've created this great friendship and we just we just talk well together. We connect well together. Yeah. And we figured, you know, we relate well together that this would be fun. Um, and also I think there's, um, I don't think it's just new, more specific, but like, there's a whole. Photography can be so isolating. And so to have a podcast, I think where it's less about like, I'm gonna teach you how to do this, but just like so you can relate to some of the things. Um, it's lonely. It is lonely. It is only because. And I live in northern Michigan, not you call us West Michigan. Yeah. Okay. So like Norris. So I'm like several hours north, and there is no photographer up there that will truly, like, be friends with you. Like, they they'll be friends with you, but they view as you as competition at the same time. And it's you can't tell like it's a true friendship. But I don't know, it's really hard. It's really. Yeah, I think that's I think that's pretty specific every location and I don't know, I don't like that. You know, I'm all about community. Yeah. Over competition. Uh, at all times. Yeah. So, um, obviously to a certain degree, like, you don't want to give away all your secrets, but. No, at the same time, you want to be friends. Yeah. Like, go get coffee. Yeah. And just be like, have someone to relate to. I mean, like to go back to that really word, but, like, if I tell my husband's stories. Oh, this happened today, and this baby was really fussy or I got pooped on today. Yeah. It's like okay. And they don't relate. And I'm like, aw, I've been working on this pose for like six months. And today I think I got like the perfect shot. And he's like, yeah, that's really nice. And then just kind of like deflates, like, okay, cool. I really like it. Yeah. Excitement. Yeah yeah yeah. And like, same with Zach. He's like, all your work is so great. You know he doesn't. Yeah. Yeah I want to pick it apart because I pick it apart. Good. And I want someone else to be like right now he's the best supporter. Yeah. Don't get me wrong. He's a great sport. Yeah. But I yeah he doesn't share the excitement. They don't get it. But anyways we digress. And that's going to happen a lot. Like I feel like we were just in the car. We had to run a little air and the whole time we're talking and I'm like, can you just stop talking? This is the podcast. Put a pin in it. Yeah. So maybe we should start with introductions. So like, people know us. Yeah. Yeah. First. Sure. Um, so I'm Jackie, um, I am in Grand Rapids. I'm a new born photographer here. I specialize in newborn photography, but I'll do first year milestones. Family. I think typically that's what it's like for everybody. But, um, I was born on the lakeshore. Or not born. I lived to meet that. At this. I lived on Lakeshore and saw in Michigan. See, this is what happened to us. Um, and I moved here when I met my husband, and I started my business. Gosh, now it's almost four years. So right after Covid pandemic, um, and I started it because honestly, I looked I was having my youngest son and I looked at like newborn photographers. I'm like, that's not that hard. And so, like, I bought a light and I was like, I can do this. I know how to do photography. I've done it before. And, you know, you go down that Google rabbit hole and, um, I took his newborn pictures and oh, they're, um, they're awful. But I caught the bug. Like, yeah, after I did that, I was like, no, I know these are awful, but now I really want to know how to do this. So, um, I found Hello Little, which is where I think we got a lot of our education from, too. And where we connected. Yeah. And I was like, that's it. I'm signing up for their education because I want to learn safety. I want to know lighting. And then I don't know. From there it's been a sponge and it's honestly it's an addiction. Yeah. Like it's awful. But this week I had nothing scheduled and I purposely. Didn't schedule anything because I'm like, I'm just going to take a week off, right? And halfway through the week, I was like, hey, Ariel, do you want to do a session together? I think you posted something about like wanting to do a model or something like that and like, let's do a model. Do you want it? Yeah. Yeah. So that work. It is an addiction. I can't take a week off. Like I feel weird. That's crazy. But see, I don't I'm at a point in my life where, like, I can take a week off and I feel really great about it, but then. But then, like, the next week, I'm like, crap. I didn't make any money last week and then I feel guilty. Yeah, but I think mine is more like a financial standpoint because like, I'll have these ebbs and flows where if I'm too busy, I get overwhelmed and then I get anxious, depressed, and then kind of fall into this black hole. Yeah, but if I'm not busy enough, then I'm like, I need to get busy, busy, busy, busy. Yeah. And then I go right back into, like, I'm too busy. Oh, crap. I'm full. And, yeah, I think it was. You experienced that? Oh, yeah. A lot. Yeah. Like, um, all the time. Yeah. It's it's weird. It's weird. It's. You want you want to do it all the time, and then you get like, oh my gosh, there's so much. And then because you're literally doing it all, you're not. We talked today and I said, if I could just photograph sessions like that's all I did, I would be like happy as a clam. That's what I want to do. But I'm also doing back end work, you know, like our website, uh, answering inquiries, getting back and forth with clients. Um, editing like it's all. And then just cleaning. Yeah, I was just cleaning like that a long time. Yeah, I'll hire that out. Right? I mean, there's things you have to do. You're literally a one man show all the way from being your own essential janitor and then. And your CEO and your CFO and like, yeah, you're. And you can work with some of that, but that also costs money. And then it comes to the point, like, how much do I want to outsource and now has a raise my prices to cover that so that I'm actually making an income. Um, yeah. It's like it's more of a balance. It really is. And it's hard being a business owner, for sure, but it's so rewarding, I love it. Rewarding? Yeah, I can imagine doing it truthfully. Yeah. So. But tell me a little about yourself. Okay, so I guess name. I'm Ariel. Yeah. Um, I'm. I'm newly married, like, two months ago, but not a new relationship. So 20 years of being together, we are such a plus. Yeah, I know, but I really do. I look that old. I have, like, a 20 year relationship, but no, we met when I was. We got together when I was 14. Don't recommend. Um, and we have six children together. Um, but we finally got married on our 20th anniversary, which was really fantastic. That's really cool. Yeah. Um, but obviously starting out life at 14. Becoming an adult at 15. And we had our first baby when I was 15 and he was almost 17. So like, we had to grow up really, really fast. And I've always been into art. I was actually going to go to art college because I was a painter. Okay, I don't know that. Yeah, I actually painted portraits for like, commissions. Oh, yeah. That was a very I was going to say I want to ask you, like, are you actually good at it? I will show you something. Yeah, I actually was, um, but I was like a realism portrait painter, and, um, I was actually good at it. I mean, I don't doubt it, but I just kind of, like, fell out of it because I didn't like making money doing it. I didn't like that pressure. And so I always kind of like, was I was my hobby. I couldn't make money doing it because it killed the joy for me. Um, but anyway, after having our daughter, I went into nursing because that was like, first of all, the nurses that took care of me. And I had her saved my life altogether. So immediately I knew I wanted to do that. Um, and then obviously I needed a career that made money. So I went into nursing. I graduated my nursing degree in 2014, and then I've been a nurse ever since. So now I work in labor and delivery, but now I barely work there. I barely work at a hospital anymore. I do newborn photography full time now and I started my business. Let's see. So Covid and my fifth child happened close to the same time. So he was born in 2021. Okay. Um, and I started photography, like photographing families and things like that outside in September of 2020. And then, um, I really wanted to do newborns, so, like. Way. Backtrack. I have a niece, Zach's, um, sister's daughter, so she's like 15 now. When she was born, I'm like, I gotta do her newborn photos. Yeah. Like, I have to. And so we went to Hobby Lobby. We got, like, this black backdrop. We got all, like, the flower crowns, and we got a mirror. I don't know why I got a mirror. Yeah, but I never knew. A photographer starts out exactly the same way. I was, like, trying to copy jcpenney's. I like, feels like I have a picture of my oldest because we did jcpenney's photos when she was born, and it was like holding the hand out with the head in, and they got all. They got them exact one on my body. He's in my hand like this. He's like, look at this cute little baby too. Oh my gosh. So yeah, I wanted to do that. And so I tried that with her and it was the best thing ever. It was so like bad. But at the time I was so proud of it. Yeah. And, um, obviously I have no record of it because it was all burnt to a CD. Yeah, I totally did it myself. And like, yeah, it was on a CD and I gave it to the to her dad and I'd never seen it since. I'm sure they appreciate it. I don't know, but yeah. So she's like 15 now. And that was like the one and only time. And um, I always wanted a camera and I could never afford it. So I only had a point and shoot one. And then I've had a, I had a DSLR camera in my Amazon cart for about ten years. Like, it was just I kept it in and out, in and out. I could never afford it. So, um, so when Covid happened, we used the stimulus checks. I bought my camera. We built the studio on the basement, like we. And I'm like, we're both wrong and I want to do this. And, um, Zach has always supported every single. I'm a serial entrepreneur. I've had, like, five different businesses. Over the years and he's like, maybe no one will stick you, no one will be successful. So sweet. And so he's just he's always supported it and he's like, okay, let's do it. And so, um, he's he's amazing. And then, um, so yeah, he built our basement into a studio because it's a walkout basement is all of 400ft². And I started newborn photography officially in April of 2021 when the studio was done. Oh my gosh, we started at the same time. Did we really? Yeah, I got because I officially launched like soft launched my business in April 2021 when my nephew was born. What? That is really funny. And Zach's cousins, that was the first baby. I thought, oh my god, that's funny. I still remember, like I also did her one year or two and yeah, she's like 4 or 5. Now. Sometime we'll have to post these like inside a podcast to show you like, like the progression of our work. I I'll never get the one from 15 years ago I haven't gotten I have one of my son. And, um, that was hilarious. Yeah. Um, but my nephews, I always use um, for like, before and after. Yeah. As far as, like for me to, to guide, especially like when I feel in a rut of my work and I feel like I just, I don't like any of my work, and it has nothing to do with the baby or anything. It is the technical side of it. So whenever I feel in a rut, I put a picture. Sorry Kate, I, I love you. I apologize so much for a newborn. Um, I put his picture next to like, the same pose of a recent baby because then I'm like. I'm gonna go or something. I mean, this this work is worth it. Like, that's that's what it is. Um. And. Yeah. It's amazing. That's awesome. That's crazy. Yeah. I actually, um, at the time, my Lincoln, he's four now. I did when I finally got my first beanbag. So, like, I jumped in. So as being a labor and delivery nurse, and I feel like I needed the training for, like, the safety and stuff like that. So I started with finding Kelly Brown, and so I signed up for all of her stuff and all of her lessons and education and stuff like that, and she used the beanbag. So I was like, I got a beanbag. I got, um, drops from Etsy, and I got a light and a PLM and all these things, but I got my beanbag first and my backdrop first and not my light. So I used my window light. I set it all up in my living room. So I gotta practice, you know? And I had my six week old and I had pictures of him, and it's the flattest lighting ever. Yeah, but he like, I actually said like, yeah, he like the pictures. I told my sister. I'm so sorry. I love that. And I'm like, no, you can be honest. It's okay. Like, I'm sorry, I don't. Well, I think like clients like that we work with don't really because they're not in the world that we're in. Yeah. They don't see it as an imperfect photo. They see it as their baby. Yeah. You know, so I think that's a huge thing for us to just kind of try and remember, like, we are our own worst critics because we're trying to, like, technically improve lighting and shadows and editing and colors and all these things and poses, but they're just wanting pictures of their baby. Yeah. You know, and I think I need to get out of my head on that sometimes, I always do. I'm perfectionist. I am my worst critic. Like, it's. It's honestly maybe a fault of mine. True. Both of ours. Yeah. Yeah. That I will look at an image and I will absolutely hate it. And somebody will be like, that's the best thing ever. And I have to remind myself, like, perfection. There is no perfectionism in this field. There is none. Yeah. They're always going to want to do something different or better, right? I remember I posted a picture of the very first newborn I photographed besides Lincoln and my niece, like the actual client, John and I posted that as my model call because I wanted to build my portfolio and it blew up like everyone thought. It was amazing. And now I look at it and I'm like, that's really not that great. Oh. I like it. People were impressed by that. And I'm like, okay, yeah, I am impressed by me now. Yeah, I know right. I'm so good. Okay. So and then that brings us to today. Well, you had six kids. Yes. So I have five. Okay. So we we both have a gaggle of kids. Yes. And age ranges are close. Yeah. So you're you had one, 2222222 20, 21. I had 1 in 2021 as well. Yeah. So he'll be four in July and he's my youngest. So you haven't even a young one. Well he turned four in February. Okay. Yeah. So we I have 18, 15, ten, eight, four and two. Okay. I have a 22 year old bonus daughter, and an 18 year old will be 19. She'll be 19. It makes me feel so. Oh my God. It'll be 19 at the end of this month. And then I have nine, six and three, so we pretty much started off. Yeah. I look at my husband and I'm like, you could have been done. If you didn't have, you would have done. You could have been done. Like you could have been living your life as like some off somewhere fun bachelor. Now, right now we have kids enough that we didn't put the rug out. Size warning. There's a lot more if you could. I don't know if I should say this on here. My husband watches it. Um, sometimes I do like. So. Our youngest, I call him the. We both call him the trickster. He's the sweetest. He is like. Honestly, he tricks us into thinking all babies should be like this. Um, but I think we're done. I mean, I think my heart. I always hoped I would get that feeling like I'm done. I mean, some people feel that I'm done feeling, you know, like. Yeah, that's awesome. And I remember going in and giving birth to him, and I'm like, I hope I get that feeling because this pregnancy was so easy. Um, everything was so easy. And I'm like, I just hope that I feel that feeling like our family is complete. And I had him in like, sorry. Oh, and within like 20 minutes I'm like, I want another one. Oh my God. And that's huge. It was like, you give birth and you're like, oh, I want another one. Yeah. Yeah. And then other times when I have like a hard time finding a model, I'm like, I just had another baby. Now I can practice this all the time. But then, you know, like today, I called my sitter and our six year old is. Throwing a foam sword at the three year old, and I was crying. And I'm like, there's a lot of chaos in there. Yeah, I don't think I need to add any more of that. I feel the same. Like if Zach didn't have like a hard no to it, I would have like two more. Yeah, silly. But then I'll be sitting at my desk in the corner of the living room editing, and it's just screaming and crying and arguing and I'm like, yeah, well, I'm good, good girl too. And and you have this too. And there's no separate and age ranges to give them. Like, is there all, I think in one group age, just like you can do the same thing and then they're all getting something out of it. But when they're so separate, like going to the zoo with my 19 year old, although he'd go and he'd have fun, like that's not connecting with him as much as like going, like honestly going and watching him play his sport is how I connect with him because that's he feels like, hey, we can talk about this afterwards or whatever, right? Um, and like these, I have to connect with them differently. And that's hard. Yeah, hard. It is like all these different ages and different stages. Yeah. Like the connections are all. And then they're always adjusting. Like once you get adjusted to one, it changes. Yeah. I'm like, oh crap. Now what? Yeah. So like I have three youngest because they're all similar ages, especially with my three year old now getting older. It's like we can do one thing and they're all happy and they feel like they've gotten time and attention from me and they feel fulfilled. Right. Um, so that's kind of nice. Yeah, it's gonna be weird next year with just three youngest. Like, I don't think it's sunk in yet. I don't even think of any of that. I just, I kind of feel like my 18 year old will never leave, you know? Like, I feel like maybe she might one day, but, like, right now, I don't see it happening. I kind of secretly hope my night never looks really mean. Heath, we grew up together. Yeah, like I was in college when I had him. And we literally, like, yeah, We had to grow up together. So that's why I kind of like a little soft spot. We don't play favorites in our house, but, like, there is a soft spot for him because we. Yeah, we have a good bond. I guess like when she stays in her room and, like, doesn't ever come out, decides to go to work or to eat, I feel like she doesn't want to be around us and this is like a hard time for her. It's like the soiling on stage, like somebody had said that on line because, I mean, I love my son, I don't I am going to have a hard time with leaps. But also like right now he's making it really easy. Yeah. Like okay. And I know once he goes I'd be like, nope, come back, come back. Yeah. But like right now I'm like, yeah, you can go like that, right? For a minute, for a minute and then come home real like, come back on me again please. Right. Do you think that, um, like, how do you think your kids impact work? You know what I'm saying? Like, that is hard for me. Like balance. Work and kids I feel like is my biggest struggle. Yeah, I feel like I'll get so wrapped into what I'm doing that I kind of forget that I'm a mom for a minute. Yeah, and I don't give them that attention. And then once I'm finally out of working, then I'd be like, crap, I missed the whole day with I, I missed everything. Yeah. And then I'll feel so guilty. Yeah. So like that balance. And like you mentioned time blocking like the other day. Yeah. Like, I feel like that might be a good thing to try. Um, and then, like, recommended I move all my stuff to the studio so I can technically clock in, clock out. And, like, when I'm home, I leave everything at the studio in my head, you know, and not worry about anything. I'm like, I like that idea. Honestly, like, I think it's a great idea in theory. I don't think I like it personally because, like, I just spend so much time on the computer that I'll probably be gone. And like every time I'm there working, I'll feel guilty for not being home. And then every time I'm at home, I'll feel guilty for not being at studio working. Right. Yeah. So how do you do it? I don't know. Like we don't ask for help. No. That's area. We're still learning. I feel the same way. Like, it's a little trickier with me, not just with me. I think you've experienced this, too. But, like, my husband works full time. Like no one is out of the house full time. And because this business part of it really took off from like, a hobby. Mhm. Um, not that he, he supports me 110% in my dreams and goals, but I think it's hard for him to look at this as like. Of business and not a hobby. Um, so there's those expectations that my main job is a mom, like, say, a home mom. And then this is my hobby. But in my mind, I'm like, no, no, this is a legit business. And I have people who are relying on me for like, I have people rely on me all it's like business wise and home wise. And so I struggle with how to people pleaser to oh how to how to keep everybody happy. And then sometimes it comes at the detriment of myself. Like like truthfully, I think it's like a mom thing. Everyone comes before yourselves. Yeah. That's huge. They throw in the business stuff and it's like you're getting lower and lower on the totem pole. Do you think you'll ever, like, change his mindset about hobby versus business at a certain income level, or do you does he like, see what does he see the income you bring in? And does he view it as a health. So he does the taxes and so he gets to see that okay. Although this year he's like, I'm not doing this anymore. Um, right. So he sees it. And like honestly I definitely could bring in more I think if I pushed myself out of a comfort zone that I'm in right now. Right. Um, I think that would help a lot if I, if it were more of like, yeah, I think I'm bringing in, I'd be more like business wise. But yeah, to me, I look at it as like, I can't bring in more unless I put more time into the business part of it. So like, um, like there's that growth period. Right. So like, your return isn't going to be instantaneous. So raising my prices or changing my pricing structure is not going to be like, it's not instant. Yeah. Um, there's some growing pains. Yeah. And he and his career like he is, he does really well in his career. So I don't think I'll ever make. The salary that he pulls in. So I'll never be the the main income winner. But like I do think if I were to bring in more yeah. Contribution wise that like that he might change his change his mind maybe. Yeah. And he like all this being said, he is 110% like super supportive and like he's the one that pushed me to get the studio, which now I'm in love with. Right? Yeah. Um, so if it were for him on the back end, um, I would not even be here. I probably wouldn't give it up. Not ever. Have you ever calculated your hourly wage? No. I'm scared too. I yeah, like I, I had to if I did mine and before because, um, I guess oh I liked uh, I mean there we go back. Okay. So, um, you reconsidered what they call a shoot and burn? Yeah. So we're all here for it. So the business models, the business structures are very different. Yeah. Um. And I'm convincing her to come to my side. She's right, she's right. Because you. You're worth it 100%. So you are considered what they call a shoot and burn, which I think is just a horrible thing. I do, too, but. Okay, it is, it is. That's that's for a different episode, right? Yes. Right. And then I'm what they consider an IPS. So IPS though doesn't have to necessarily mean high prices. It's just an in-person sales model for the experience for the client. Yeah. Which is you know, but I didn't jump my prices up because when I was a shoot and burn, I, I did make quite a bit of money, but like, I didn't feel like it was enough. To be impactful. Like, Zach had a full time construction job, but he was killing himself and it was hard labor. He needed neck surgery, which is, you know, another thing that happened a few months ago. He had neck surgery. And it's just like I hated seeing him. Like he would he would leave at 6 a.m. and he'd come home by 6 p.m.. Yeah, because it was an hour and 20 minute, one way commute. He would come home completely exhausted, completely spent. He would sit on a couch and he would just be angry. He'd be like, tired. He'd be frustrated. And then he obviously cooked dinner because I'm not a cook. I'm bad at it. If you want to survive food, I mean, that's the thing we have. I know that I can follow a recipe, but I'm not a good cook. And so he and he loved cooking. He was actually he was a chef before he was in construction. That's to say that he ran a whole kitchen like for a few years. So. Okay, so he's actually a good cook. But anyway, he was just completely spent his body hurt and he was grumpy. He didn't want to do things fun with the kids. He was missing out on the kids. And it was like seeing him being so miserable is what really lit a fire under me, because I always thought of my cereal businesses. I've always had the goal of getting to a point where I've let him quit his job and support everybody. I think my husband wishes I would do that and I like that. That is that was my goal, like for years because he, you know, he left school, got a GED, and he's been working nonstop for me to go to college. He's done a lot of sacrifices. Yeah, he's sacrificed for me. So I want to sacrifice for him. So that was that was my turning point for switching my sales model and upping my prices. Not that I thought I was worth the prices, because honestly, that was like a huge, scary mental jump. Yeah. Really is. I still struggle, like, if inquiries are low and suddenly I suck. Yeah, and I'm not good enough. Or no one asks me to photograph the baby. You know, like, I get that feeling all the time. I'm not. I mean, like I said, the income change, like I'm making over triple what he made in a year last year now. And so he can finally quit his job. And I feel like that's amazing. Do you feel like that helps balance like. The family. This is like I think it helps because he's home so he can be what the kids need. Yeah, that I can't provide in the moment when I'm busy. Sure. Granted, I still feel mom go big time, but he's there now to, like, take up the slack. Because before, when he was working and I was working at home, the kids were feral children and they felt ignored. Yeah, they felt like their like their mom wasn't paying attention. Dad was gone. Yeah, they they were bored. They were. They were feral children. Yeah. They they resorted to video games and iPads and screens as babysitters. Yeah. Like I didn't know what I was trying to build a business, and yeah, dad was working. But now, like, I feel like that mental struggle that I went through that I still in going through was so worth it because they're seeing like happiness and more connection, more happiness, more freedom. That was granted some stresses are still there. Like low increments. That's going to be there forever. Like I feel like no matter what you can be, I think the most. Celebrated photographer in the world. You could be making over like six figures, but like, yeah, $400,000 a year. But I feel like that struggle is always going to be there. Absolutely. That's kind of the artist's mind. Like, it's so funny when you mix art and business together. It's like, I'm not good. Instead of like, okay, there's a marketing, something missing. Marketing, it's all of a sudden I'm not good enough. And yeah, like, that's that whole struggle as an artist, like. Right. That's that's a piece of your soul out there. Oh, absolutely. Like, I feel that way. And I feel that way when I'm photographing babies. I'm like, I understand, like I'm a service that I'm providing. Like, people are hiring me is it's their baby and it's their baby's picture. But in my mind, like, this is my art. Like, right. It's your art and my art and my thing. All right. Oh my gosh. And like and of course there is sometimes when you do the in-person sales part. I have had a few clients not like the photos that I like. And or they only want to pick their minimum whatever their budget can allow or whatever. It is a little soul crushing like I like don't like the ones that I thought were great. Like, can I go through the technicalities? This is so good. I know, I'm like, are you sure? No, I like look at this lighting. This is great lighting. Do you see shadows? Like, they look so great. And the color is so like. That's your face. I know, but yeah. So there is a little bit of soul crushing in that, but also to like. I've had a few moms cry, like when I show my slide show, because I'll put my slideshow in music to, like, see that? I mean, if you're out there and you were a client and you cried, will you please let me know? Because I don't get to hear that. I do get a lot of likes, but their first reactions are I do get a lot of messages like, I love, I love these pictures, or I had a really hard time picking. So my structure is different. As far as, um, that I'm not technically. I think that shoot and burn, I kind of, but because I do soft proofing and I do limited galleries, so I think I consider shooting burn. Like I said, you and I make everything. Um, I what I do is I'll do the session. Um, and then I have like, packages where it comes with a certain digital images. Mhm. Um, and so what I would send my clients is a very narrowed down number of photos that we took. And then they would pick their favorites and then I would edit them, which is exactly what I did before. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's like I guess they're like a hybrid. Yeah. Hybrid thing. I don't know if. Yeah, if there's people out there that want to politically correct us. You're welcome. To leave a comment below. Yeah we're okay. But yeah, so I do like that idea. I do think. So my fear is. So we're kind of going off what our subject was, but kind of right. It kind of good. It it kind of circles back. Yeah. So my fear with going IPS has always been, like I said earlier, I love the shooting part of it, and I fear, I not fear. I feel like when someone's talking about switching to IPS, a lot of the the noise is, will you make more money and you shoot less, you have less work. And that's totally like what it is. But in my mind I'm like, I want to shoot more. I don't want to do the other stuff more. So I have this fear that like, I jump to that and then I am charging more than what I am now and I have less clients, which is in fact, what you want to happen is I'm like, I missed the shooting part of it to be harder than honest. When I made the switch, I actually got busier. I see. So like I actually had more sessions and I got to a point where I couldn't handle it very well. Okay. And also to when you are making more money, you can gift sessions. That's true more often. But then so how this plays into the family is like, um, so I think a lot of us out there, our kids are in summer break now. Oh, God. Um, and I'm bored. Oh, it's like a week in the summer. I'm bored. But my four year old says that. Now, where do you think he gets it? Yeah, he's a brother. Yeah. Um, are you a four year boy? Right? Yeah. Okay. My. Yeah, I well, my oldest is a girl. My own. This is a girl in the middle for boys. Yeah. Okay, babes, I don't have that. Um, so I knowing it's a two weeks before summer break, my kids were insane, I mean, insane. My 18 year old, 18, almost nine year old, just graduated. Um, and then the other kids, I don't know, something. My six year old bit his ass. Sorry. And she is like. So tight, you know? And I was like. Like summer break was staring me in the face. And I said, I had ten weeks of this. Like, I love our teachers. You guys all need raises because, holy cow. Um, you guys keep them entertained all day. Yeah. So I was staring in the face and I thought, I really want to be more intentional about my time this summer. Um, so this is circling back to the IPS. Yeah. And, like, making more time for my kids because I have been working so hard the last four years now to build a business, but also to build my craft. Um, and I do feel like that's pulled me away a lot from being like, nah, I mean, mom, they're alive, they're fed, they they're loved. But, like, really being present. Present. And, um, so I said this summer, like, I really want to be intentional with my time because not only do I need to do that, but I do need to pour into myself more like, yeah, like, even if it's just taking a walk in the morning, like, oh my gosh, to give myself that exercise again. Yeah. What is to make myself feel good. Um, so. Which is funny that you say that because literally a couple days ago, I pulled up a notion and I made a bucket list, and I'm like, okay, Zach. Like, I need a bucket list. So I'm like, okay. And I looked at that and I'm like, okay, so Liz, what do you want to do this summer with kids? Like what? What do you want to do? Like, we're gonna plan stuff like, it's not going to be like, expensive stuff. It's going to be just, like, intentional. Yeah. Get out and do something fun. Because every summer it's been about survival. I feel like I feel like up until I switched IP's. I hate to just say that, but it's true up until I switched to IPS. It is. Literally every day is all about then surviving. Yeah, it's not about it's not been thriving in the day. Yeah. And it's surviving finances and like trying like we literally were borrowing from Peter to pay Paul. Yeah. We were circling and I had a couple of maternity leaves that were longer than expected. And we went into a lot of debt. Yeah. And our credit scores reflected that. And so it was just like. This terrible cycle of just surviving and not being happy and just kind of being miserable with the emotions and stuff like that. Yeah. And like, we're finally at this point in our lives where, yes, I am still chasing the business, like just stressing about bookings like everyone else. But, um, I feel like finally we're at a point where we can breathe and thrive and enjoy life with our kids. Like we can take intentional vacations. We can take intentional trips, like we're not tied to a 9 to 5. We're not tied to certain things. Like we can make our own schedules. We can. We got we have a savings now, like this is this is finally you can breathe. This is finally life. Yeah. Like we're living. And, um, and so we made a bucket list, and it was things like going on a hike and going to the U.P. and going to, like, all these different places. We went to see the Bear Ranch and, you know, going to the Dinosaur Park or whatever. But like, there are cheap things. We are highly intentional. And it's just like we have little things on ours too. Like, this might be the one for you to put on there. Yeah. Um, water balloon baseball. I mean, we got those, like, reusable water balloons, and we're like, we're just going to go take. And I intentionally, in my notes wrote water balloon baseball. No technology, no phones, no nothing because. Otherwise I'd be out, throw my phone on, take pictures, and then all of a sudden these lips open up. I've gotta go to. Oh, oh, I gotta inquiry. I'm gonna answer this or I've got an email from a client. Hold on. Let me just take care of this. Right. So I have it intentionally. Intentionally put in there. No apology. Like we're just going to go and play with water balloons for 15 minutes, like, yeah, 15 minutes. Uh, that's baby steps. Yeah. So yeah, we did that too, and I but I created block scheduling. I know we talked about this a little bit so that I could make sure that I was balancing my day, like, between business. So I didn't feel like I was pulled away from business too much or at the end of the day. And like, I have so much stuff, I feel overwhelmed. But also like I'm taking those breaks to just look my kids in the eye and be like, let's play. Yeah, let's just like, let's go, let's have fun. And I put the schedule up for that. So like things we did is like, we have breakfast time and okay. Today, just like when you go to school, here are your breakfast choices. Like you have three choices. What do you want? Instead of like what do you want for breakfast. Right. I like and I plan like my weeks kind of based on what's happening. So like, you know, this is a big week for work next week. So I have it right, really scheduled where we're not doing anything huge for our bucket list, but we're going to do little things so that in between my sessions or whatever, that I can just give you my time because, yeah, that guilt is weighing on you. Oh my gosh. Yeah. Which like it kind of leads into I also wanted this podcast to try and be like helpful. Yeah. To some people that are like listening, like maybe you're struggling in these areas or maybe you're not. Um, so if you're not, feel free to chime in. Um, but I. Had that in where? Um, did we touch on mental health? I mean, I think it's all mental. I think it's on us. Okay. Yeah. Um, ways to help moms in the business. So, like I just said, shared calendars. Huge. Yeah. Like, now, my older two children have jobs, and so, like, I need to know their job schedules. And now that my oldest has a driver's license and a car. Like, I need to know where you're going and what, when and where. And so now, like and we're in the day and age where everyone has a phone, everyone has an iPad. And yeah, my young kids don't have access, but it's like everyone is sharing a calendar. So now everyone has knows what's happening. Yeah. It's happening. You have like 360 other kids. That too. I do too. I do, I do. Okay. So my 19 year old asked me to take it off because he's like, mom, I'm graduated. I'm going to college. That's still a hard no for me. I, I did tell him I was like, it can come off, but like, you have to you have to tell me. And I said, you're not asking me anymore. You're an adult. Like, I get that you need some freedom, but you have to tell me you're my roommate at my house, so, like, I be respectful. Don't come in at 3 a.m., but, like, please tell me where you're at. So if something were to happen, it's not going to be like, where is he? I don't know how to help him or whatever. Right? Yeah, but life through 60 is amazing. Watch my daughter turn it off once, and I'm like, girl. Okay, my cycle is well. I was like, oh, mom's here. Okay. Yeah. It's like you're tracking me now. Yeah, I could track me too. Oh, okay. That was a Hobby Lobby man. Mom's getting work done. Oh my God. The other thing we have in common is I'm, like, an obsessive knitter. I wish I could work for me, too. So I'm. I think that's something I need a block time for. Knitting. I did nervous knit last. I was nervous, but I've also been dealing with tennis elbow. And so the knitting kind of like aggravates it a little bit. But I have like five sweaters that I've been trying to work on. And so I was looking at the life of an artist, like for the last few days. I ended up on it last night for today's session that we didn't even use, so we did. She didn't even show me. Well, because I don't like it. I mean, I don't really do it. It's the perfectionism doesn't just end. No, it's like literally our whole lives. Yeah. But like, that's the mental health thing we're talking about is like, because this isn't a hobby anymore. Like, I really do need to give myself the time to to find a hobby. Yeah, I mean truthfully. So knitting is a good life, but like, knitting is my favorite. And binge watching crime shows. Okay, I've done my dirty little secret. Don't judge me, sister wise, I don't know. I have a brilliant sister, I know I don't have a sister. I'm sorry. Okay. So, studio wise, you know wiser, right? Yeah. It is so trashy. But, like, I don't, I can't, I can't, I just, I can't do reality TV. I don't know what it is I can do, like crime dramas. Not the real crime. Like. Oh, no, that's like the ones where they go on trial. Yeah. Like. No, it was like it has to be the crime dramas like Blue Bloods or Law and Order or. Okay, Criminal Mind, that's soap opera that calls on my soaps. Yeah, my show shows like I have, like, I have a few of them, like every episode that renewed, like in the next episode, I watch the next, I love it. It's so bad. No, but it's just you do need that. Like, that's an outlet for sure. So, like, just around it because I think we're at 45 minutes. Yeah. I know it's not going to be like this always. I promise it's probably will. Okay. I would probably worry. Sorry. Um, but just to break it down into, like, smaller chunks. Um, so ways to help moms, other moms, fellow moms in, uh, whether it be business as a photographer or just in business in general. Um, so we recommend sharing your calendars with your family members. Um, scheduling things out. Um, like blog posts. That's another thing I forgot to completely touch on is like when you are in like when I'm in the busy mode, I forget to post, oh forget to blog post. I get all my marketing, I schedule that shit out. Well, see, I should say that we can swear, um, like Sundays. That's. Those are my days. Sundays I will sit on that computer. Usually when the kids are in bed, I always think, like, I would do it Mondays because it's marketing Monday. Yeah, like do whatever. Something like I will sit down and I will do like a meta. They have like you can schedule a week ahead of time okay. You can even have stories if you wanted to. I don't think I'm really bad at it. I schedule online polls and with all of the, um, captions that I want for the whole week, and then I'll just take images that I've been working on and I'll put that in there. And a lot of times my captions have nothing to do. Images. Right. I mean, they're just pretty. I don't know if you have to use ChatGPT. Oh, look at you. I don't yeah, I mean, we use it all the time because, like, you're not always going to be creative enough to come up with something catchy. I was not a speaker and I'm so bad at. Yeah. And I probably I would put an emoji for my caption. I probably had more typos in the spellings. Oh yeah. That was that was what I studied. Um. That's funny. Oh yeah. So yeah, I want to get that out because my fault is where like I get really busy and I forget to mark it. And then suddenly when I'm not busy, I haven't been marketing. So now nothing's coming in. Yeah. So then I'll market market, market. And then someday I'm really busy again and then I forget to market. And I was like, this is a roller coaster. I've given myself like that goal of, like, just post constantly. And I'm probably super annoying about it because people want to just stop. Well, I've had like finally like, okay, I'm going to post this in the morning and once in the afternoon. I've been doing that for a few days. So I'm hoping that's once a day I'm a once a day or. Yeah, but so some days I'll sit and I'll schedule it that whole week. And then I tried to one blog post on Wednesdays. I don't know why Wednesdays. It's just in my mind. I'm like, Wednesdays are blog post days. That's maybe we should just check in with each other and like, hey, did you do your blog post? No, which is another thing I have on here. Connect with other photographers. Like that's really because it is a lonely thing. It is very lonely and I that's really hard mentally. Yeah really hard. And if you can use one as an accountability partner. Yeah. You know, or just to bounce ideas off of like I know we text each other all the time like, hey, can you give me a second pair of eyes on this? Because I don't know what I'm doing wrong, but it's not looking how I want to. And and I'll be honest with you, Joe, nine times out of ten, you're like, this is what I need. I'll do it. I'm like, that's it. Yeah, I wasted 40 minutes. But it's funny because, like, sometimes like, you'll send that or you post it, you know, post it in one of our groups and like, something's wrong. What is it? And everyone's like, I don't know, but it's perfect. Like, no, it's not. And I'm like, that's not helpful. No. I was like, when you asked me in a text, I be honest. Yeah. I'd be like, okay, I'm gonna really study this and like, okay, I'm going to give you a legit answer. I'm not going to blow smoke up because I feel like instead of being like, oh, this is perfect. I think if you're like really actively looking, no, this needs to change. Right? But sometimes I need that validation and I need someone like that. I don't know, it's just like, look at this pretty picture and say you love it. Yeah. Or look how cute this baby is. And then that's usually a sign like, I don't you don't judge it, you don't judge it. But if you need the critique, you're actually asking for it. I think that is really important mentally, especially if you're like even um, so it's like if you're a mom and a photographer because there is so much mentally on you, then to have that person that you can just like. I don't just connect with. Yeah, most people have coworkers at other jobs, but they they can connect with at work. And here, like you connect to their clients when they're here. And then it's like, okay, bye. Yeah. Cool. Three hours. But now I have ten hours of work to do on your session, and I'm not gonna talk to you the whole time. Right. Um, so just I'll probably hear from you when you ask for your photos. Ah, that's about it. Sorry about that. I'm really bad. So that's that's usually like like, oh, my gosh, there's so much going on. Yeah. I will say, for the first time in over a year, I thought, oh my God, that doesn't mean I'm done editing, but I have. Yeah, but I am like ahead of schedule. I'm at the point where it's the first time I'm less than ten galleries left, like I have seven. I mean, that's my goal for. Yeah. Like I've been stuck at 15 or more for like years now. It's I'm down to seven, but in my climb back up, I don't know. It's definitely too. Yeah. I mean add one one right. I say yeah yeah. And then okay, so um, so creating the bucket list, which I totally I wanted to like kind of quick fire these off and sidetracked so. Oh that's cool. Um, so highly recommend sharing your calendars with your family members and your older kids. Schedule things out in time. Um, so your posts and your blog posts don't get forgotten about, um, time blocking your day. Setting business hours. I know that's so much easier said than done, but it's so worth a try. Um, so another thing is I put automated messages on your socials to direct people to your contact page, so that way they can fill out your contact form and then you can get back to them when you're available versus answering emails. Oh, yeah. In the morning I don't keep checking it. And I think that sometimes that's in society we live in. It's bad. Yeah. And being a slave to your message, you know what I mean? Like, I feel like most people are expecting that quick response. Yes. And I might have lost clients from that because I'm not the one that's going to be like, oh, there it is. But I literally I can't, I can't be on that day. Especially like people that shop around, they expect instant answers and they'll go with the person that answers first morning times like 45 minutes in the morning. That's when I answer my emails and then that's it. I mean, if they answer back, if they've waited 24 hours and they answer back and they still want to work with you, then that means that they weren't just shopping around for prices. They actually want to work with you. They're willing to wait. And I think that's huge. Um, and the other one was setting time in your schedule to completely disconnect from work, focus on your kids, which we've touched on, and then creating a bucket list of summer activities and then connecting with other photographers. Yeah. And friends. Yeah. I mean, I don't think. I think that there's not going to be any perfect advice. Like we are not experts at this week. Obviously fail and struggle. These are things. These are things that I have found and tried that are they're creating a little bit of breathing room, I think. Um, so absolutely. I mean, we're definitely not perfect. Um, I know these, but over the last few years, you just say you are. Oh, God, yes. You are freaking perfect. I love it. I am not a humble bone. I also can make fun of myself. Yeah, really? Well, we are good at that. Um, but I definitely we're, like, works in progress. And we've been in the business now for four years or five years. Doesn't seem that long. But I know, but and we've we've lived. I'm obsessed with what I do now. So like I put in, I feel like sometimes you're more obsessed about it than I am because, like, I was obsessed about it. Crazy in the beginning. And I feel like I'm starting to be less obsessed, and I'm not entirely sure if that's a good thing, but I think it's also it's helping me. I think it's separate from my life. Each person is different, and I think, I think I have to be obsessed with it. And I think I ebb and flow. I'm, I'm I'm a roller coaster in mentally. Yeah. Um, so, like, I'll be obsessed for a little while and then I'll be not. And you'll get that really good baby with a gallery that's, like, beautiful. And you're like, oh, I got a really bad baby. I'm not that babies are bad. Please don't think that. But I mean, like a spicy. That's a struggle. I mean, not a content baby that hates me. I'll get to that personally. Yeah. Like I'm not cut out for this. Like you quit my job. You hate me. I go to this. I'm so mad. No. Smell your smell. Like, oh, my God. And you smell like poop and pee and sweat. Oh, I definitely. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. Anyways, I digress, we digress, but our goal with this podcast is hopefully to do it every two weeks. Yeah, yeah. We're open. Yeah. So whether it be together in person or virtually, like, um, like a zoom chat kind of a thing where you see both of our faces in two different locations. Yeah. I think there's some really cool topics. Yeah. I also wanted to mention to you, like, you'll find us on all of the podcast platforms and YouTube. So if you want to see the video version of this, see our video to see our sweaty faces. I promise you, I at least I want to know you. And I will always look like you should have seen her top on earlier. That was Adam's picture on it. No no no no no, it was so good. Um, but yeah, if you want to see the video version, it will be on YouTube. Yeah. We also have like an Instagram too, that will post like maybe a little little snippets on um, and we'll, I don't know, we can tag that in the video below so you can find us there. Yeah. Um, and then you can also then find our, our business pages if you want to see like. Yeah. How are these our businesses. Are these old ladies legit? I don't really know what they're doing. I don't know. Right. Or are they just crazy? Probably a little golf. Yeah, I think so. I mean, that's really how my my business name came about. Honey. Wild. Oh, yeah. I never even really got to ask you about that. So I just view life as being really sweet, but, like, sweet and wild. All sweet and wild. Sweet and chaos. So I'm like, how do I. And then babies. Babies themselves are so sweet, but it's so wild. The stage of life is chaos. So it's funny. While that's how I. That mine is lame is just my first and middle name. I mean, I thought about that. I don't think it's lame. I just I couldn't think of anything. I think that's a luxury. Like a lot of the luxury brands. It's their name, right? I don't know. I kind of get annoyed that it's really long. So. Yeah. That's fine. Yeah, I got I mean, I've gotten used to typing it out, but it is long, I think. But it's I mean, it's aerial. Elizabeth photography. There's this honey wild photography. So that's awesome. Did you have anything you want to say? No. I think we covered a lot. Okay. This is, like, hella long. Sorry. Yeah. What are we at 55 minutes? No. We were. And then I get to stare at these lips for 55. Oh my gosh. And the lips. And they probably get to see me shake the table. Yeah, I've done that a few times. So I promise we'll be a little bit better. Yeah, as we get into this. But I do think that you guys will love some of the topics we have. And if you have any recommendations, just, um, your comments. Yeah. Your questions will help us with podcast topics. Yeah. For sure. Yeah. Yeah. I've always wanted to do a podcast. Um, do not look into YouTube history for. That. No you're not. I'm not even going to talk about it. I actually think I did delete a lot of it. A lot going there as soon as I got off of here. Um, yeah, I was I was really excited for this. And I think this is going to be amazing. So I hope to see you guys here. Hi everyone. I feature Ariel here while editing our video podcast that Jackie and I did at her studio. Um, I found that the video and audio cut out as we were saying our goodbyes. Um, so I wanted to tack this on at the end, um, to come back and officially say a proper goodbye. Um, we will make another podcast in a couple of weeks. So please make sure to subscribe and follow, and hopefully we'll see you in a couple of weeks with a great new topic. Uh, we'll talk later. Bye.